Manhunt 2 banned .. again.

Gabriel013 · 10-08-2007, 12:30 PM

Seems the BBFC still aren't happy with the edits. It claims they made suggestions which Rockstar refused so I can only assume it went against the essence of the game.

When they allow movies like SAW and Hostel to get through with 18 ratings how can they justify banning Manhunt 2?

The claim the title is about callous killing. So what! If people find it entertaining then so be it, anyone else can avoid buying it and for the love of all things cute and cuddly DON'T LET LITTLE TOMMY PLAY IT!

More details here:
http://entertainment.uk.msn.com/news...mentid=6347933

dillonthebunny · 10-08-2007, 12:39 PM

looks like i will be gettig the PSP version.. from the States!

ps, youre right Gabe, there IS NO difference between this and something like SAW.

The Benny (Macho) · 10-08-2007, 12:45 PM

While obviously opposing blanket censorship I do tend to have a fair amount of respect for the BBFC. They don't generally pander to media pressure or apply a 'think of the children' mentality to adult titles, and do genuinely seem reluctant to hand out bans. It seems the ESRB's approach was that the executions were too graphic to be acceptable and removing them allowed it to be bumped down a notch stateside, whereas the BBFC's problem lies with the tone of the game itself, which clearly is not so easily fixed.

As far as I'm aware though there are European countries that will be allowing Manhunt 2 to be released and the BBFC ban only applies to selling it in the UK, so importing from another PAL nation is fine.

dillonthebunny · 10-08-2007, 01:01 PM

thats a good plan, I believe Holland is having the full uncut version of Manhunt2..

so yeh, will probably get it from there.

I agree, the BBFC are usually good, but these days theyre are getting way too anal. its trying to protect the child, thats fair enough. but then ban everything thats wrong.
shouldnt be one rule for one and another rule for everyone else.

you cant get a 12yr old to buy a p0rno film or even buy a jazz mag in a shop.. yet they can buy GTA!

thats not my fault or R*'s fault.. its the fault of the shops selling it or the parents buying it for the child.

the BBFC should treat us all like adults, rather than assume we dont know what we want.

The Benny (Macho) · 10-08-2007, 04:37 PM

It's not about protecting the children, we just don't have the same level of free speech that the US does. In the US (at least as I understand it) any kind of media censorship violates the constitution (though you'll still find plenty of people trying to violate it to ban the latest new hobby that their generation doesn't understand), whereas the BBFC was created at a time when it was seen as necessary to have a group filter out content that lacks any reason to be viewed, heard or interacted with. Manhunt 2 falls within that category, and it's very rare for that to happen in general and to games in particular.

It does raise questions about why adults need somebody to decide what they should or should not be allowed to purchase, but then it's only when things like this get banned that people bother raising the question and attempt to do something about it. We're probably still a generation or two away from the point where most voters and politicians will have grown up with video games and similar material, which will be when such issues can be properly raised and dealt with. At the moment too many people still see gaming as being for children, so you won't find many people who will object to something like Manhunt 2 being banned. Or at least, not many of those who would be needed to object.

Gabriel013 · 10-09-2007, 02:37 AM

I think it's funny that the article raises a murder case from a while back. It fails to mention that the Manhunt game was owned by the victim, not the attacker.

It may have a calloous approach to murder but then if that's how the developers intended it to be then so be it. I don't know much of the story but if you are a proper serial killer rather than just a guy trying to survive (like in the first game) then of course the killing is going to be more visceral. That will be the whole idea.

If they use their common sense they will see that a game like GT promotes dangerous driving more than Manhunt promotes murder.

HannibleL316 · 10-09-2007, 03:07 AM

You can still pre-order it from Play.com for PS2.
Was meant to be end of August, then end of Septemeber, now its saying end of November.

Gabriel013 · 10-09-2007, 05:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by HannibleL316

You can still pre-order it from Play.com for PS2.
Was meant to be end of August, then end of Septemeber, now its saying end of November.

I'd love it if they still shipped it. I do however think that last date should say end of never. It will unfortunately never see the light of day in the UK.

The Benny (Macho) · 10-10-2007, 08:01 PM

Some interesting resources from the BBFC, some of it general and some it concerning video games in particular:

BBFC policy
Parents BBFC - The kind of site all ratings boards should have. Allows you to search for rated content to find out why it received that rating.
Video Game Submission Information
Video Games Submission Guide (PDF) - Probably the most interesting of the bunch, this includes details on what will guarantee a ban and what laws the BBFC has to take into account when rating.

Despite not being fond of censorship I do stand by my belief that the BBFC are generally a sensible group of people.

Gabriel013 · 10-11-2007, 01:34 AM

I've been reading through the last article. Thanks so much for those links. They're appreciated.

I find p13 (of their document, not the pdf) interesting:

"Taboo themes are acceptable, but not if their treatment is likely to encourage harm to viewers or, through their behaviour, to society."

How the hell does some stuffy old group of people in a back room somewhere know if what they are rating will do the above? There still isn't any clear scientific study showing that violent or sexual games have any lasting effect on an individual.

I think passing material through the BBFC for classification is great as it provides a guidline to the public but they should NOT be overstepping their remit and telling me, as an adult, that certain material is unsuitable and might harm my mind. I'll be the judge of that thank you very much.

10-08-2007, 12:30 PM	#1
Gabriel013 ArchAngel Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Sheffield, England PS3 Network ID: gabriel013 Xbox Live ID: Gabriel013 Posts: 6,689	Manhunt 2 banned .. again. Seems the BBFC still aren't happy with the edits. It claims they made suggestions which Rockstar refused so I can only assume it went against the essence of the game. When they allow movies like SAW and Hostel to get through with 18 ratings how can they justify banning Manhunt 2? The claim the title is about callous killing. So what! If people find it entertaining then so be it, anyone else can avoid buying it and for the love of all things cute and cuddly DON'T LET LITTLE TOMMY PLAY IT! More details here: http://entertainment.uk.msn.com/news...mentid=6347933 __________________ \"...and he shall ascend from the fires of Hell...\" "everyone knows second hand squirrel kills." - Svosen 3 forum tokens

10-08-2007, 12:39 PM	#2
dillonthebunny Blinkity blink blink Join Date: Feb 2003 PS2 Online ID: Dillonthebunny/HareofDoom PS3 Network ID: HareOfDoom/DillonTheBunny Posts: 5,506	looks like i will be gettig the PSP version.. from the States! ps, youre right Gabe, there IS NO difference between this and something like SAW. __________________ Legend Edgemaster of the Unicorn. oh and nine thousand fake forum tokens, 3 real ones and 5 special tokens mysteriously protected by a blinding white aura.. known to some as the 'anti wife light'.. ""Bombing for peace is like **ing for virginity" "NO OFFENCE" R.I.P @PS3

10-08-2007, 01:01 PM	#4
dillonthebunny Blinkity blink blink Join Date: Feb 2003 PS2 Online ID: Dillonthebunny/HareofDoom PS3 Network ID: HareOfDoom/DillonTheBunny Posts: 5,506	thats a good plan, I believe Holland is having the full uncut version of Manhunt2.. so yeh, will probably get it from there. I agree, the BBFC are usually good, but these days theyre are getting way too anal. its trying to protect the child, thats fair enough. but then ban everything thats wrong. shouldnt be one rule for one and another rule for everyone else. you cant get a 12yr old to buy a p0rno film or even buy a jazz mag in a shop.. yet they can buy GTA! thats not my fault or R's fault.. its the fault of the shops selling it or the parents buying it for the child. the BBFC should treat us all like adults, rather than assume we dont know what we want. __________________ Legend Edgemaster of the Unicorn. oh and nine thousand fake forum tokens, 3 real ones and 5 special tokens mysteriously protected by a blinding white aura.. known to some as the 'anti wife light'.. ""Bombing for peace is like ***ing for virginity" "NO OFFENCE" R.I.P @PS3

10-09-2007, 02:37 AM	#6
Gabriel013 ArchAngel Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Sheffield, England PS3 Network ID: gabriel013 Xbox Live ID: Gabriel013 Posts: 6,689	I think it's funny that the article raises a murder case from a while back. It fails to mention that the Manhunt game was owned by the victim, not the attacker. It may have a calloous approach to murder but then if that's how the developers intended it to be then so be it. I don't know much of the story but if you are a proper serial killer rather than just a guy trying to survive (like in the first game) then of course the killing is going to be more visceral. That will be the whole idea. If they use their common sense they will see that a game like GT promotes dangerous driving more than Manhunt promotes murder. __________________ \"...and he shall ascend from the fires of Hell...\" "everyone knows second hand squirrel kills." - Svosen 3 forum tokens

10-09-2007, 03:07 AM	#7
HannibleL316 Hello, Clarice.... Join Date: Feb 2003 PS3 Network ID: Hannible Posts: 944	You can still pre-order it from Play.com for PS2. Was meant to be end of August, then end of Septemeber, now its saying end of November. __________________ "Tina come get some ham!" 3 Forum Tokens

10-08-2007, 12:45 PM	#3
The Benny (Macho) Complainer of the year Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: England Posts: 1,375	While obviously opposing blanket censorship I do tend to have a fair amount of respect for the BBFC. They don't generally pander to media pressure or apply a 'think of the children' mentality to adult titles, and do genuinely seem reluctant to hand out bans. It seems the ESRB's approach was that the executions were too graphic to be acceptable and removing them allowed it to be bumped down a notch stateside, whereas the BBFC's problem lies with the tone of the game itself, which clearly is not so easily fixed. As far as I'm aware though there are European countries that will be allowing Manhunt 2 to be released and the BBFC ban only applies to selling it in the UK, so importing from another PAL nation is fine.

10-08-2007, 04:37 PM	#5
The Benny (Macho) Complainer of the year Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: England Posts: 1,375	It's not about protecting the children, we just don't have the same level of free speech that the US does. In the US (at least as I understand it) any kind of media censorship violates the constitution (though you'll still find plenty of people trying to violate it to ban the latest new hobby that their generation doesn't understand), whereas the BBFC was created at a time when it was seen as necessary to have a group filter out content that lacks any reason to be viewed, heard or interacted with. Manhunt 2 falls within that category, and it's very rare for that to happen in general and to games in particular. It does raise questions about why adults need somebody to decide what they should or should not be allowed to purchase, but then it's only when things like this get banned that people bother raising the question and attempt to do something about it. We're probably still a generation or two away from the point where most voters and politicians will have grown up with video games and similar material, which will be when such issues can be properly raised and dealt with. At the moment too many people still see gaming as being for children, so you won't find many people who will object to something like Manhunt 2 being banned. Or at least, not many of those who would be needed to object.

10-10-2007, 08:01 PM	#9
The Benny (Macho) Complainer of the year Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: England Posts: 1,375	Some interesting resources from the BBFC, some of it general and some it concerning video games in particular: BBFC policy Parents BBFC - The kind of site all ratings boards should have. Allows you to search for rated content to find out why it received that rating. Video Game Submission Information Video Games Submission Guide (PDF) - Probably the most interesting of the bunch, this includes details on what will guarantee a ban and what laws the BBFC has to take into account when rating. Despite not being fond of censorship I do stand by my belief that the BBFC are generally a sensible group of people.

10-11-2007, 01:34 AM	#10
Gabriel013 ArchAngel Join Date: Feb 2003 Location: Sheffield, England PS3 Network ID: gabriel013 Xbox Live ID: Gabriel013 Posts: 6,689	I've been reading through the last article. Thanks so much for those links. They're appreciated. I find p13 (of their document, not the pdf) interesting: "Taboo themes are acceptable, but not if their treatment is likely to encourage harm to viewers or, through their behaviour, to society." How the hell does some stuffy old group of people in a back room somewhere know if what they are rating will do the above? There still isn't any clear scientific study showing that violent or sexual games have any lasting effect on an individual. I think passing material through the BBFC for classification is great as it provides a guidline to the public but they should NOT be overstepping their remit and telling me, as an adult, that certain material is unsuitable and might harm my mind. I'll be the judge of that thank you very much. __________________ \"...and he shall ascend from the fires of Hell...\" "everyone knows second hand squirrel kills." - Svosen 3 forum tokens

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