Ben D.

No, I was talking about the "best" games on the PS2. I said they'd probably be FF X and GoW, and you said I "mistook" those games for SotC and WLK. I didn't reply to you, you replied to me. Yes?

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Dmitry M. (Lazer)

Why don't you learn to read everything in the thread first. This whole thread is based on personal preference and not review based. Review based is a bunch of bullshit. Why, here's why?

Review is based on graphics, gameplay, sound, controlls, etc... BULLSHIT. That's right. Why is it that ever Zelda, Halo, and MGS game get close to perfect scores?

Everything including your precious reviews are opinionated and fanboyist. Because you can't tell me that Zelda Ocarina of Time was just as good of a game as Majora's Mask, actually Majora's Mask was complete crap in gameplay, introduced nothing new, and was like a quick way to release a new Zelda game for the 64 before it died and yet i remember reading wonderful reviews on it.

All reviewers have a preconceived notion when reviewing and that's actually normal based on a Human. For Example you would not let someone that loves Rock music review Hip Hop music and vise-versa.

Also notice how certain games that are hyped up like GoW get such good reviews in replay value, when truthfully it's replay value is half as good as many other games out on the PS2.

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Dmitry M. (Lazer)

So how is you saying FFX and GoW are probably the best game for PS2 review based?

If it was based on reviews then the the best PS2 game would be Resident Evil 4 followed by GTAIII and closely in third by MGS2: Sons of Liberty. While your GoW would only be 10th best based on reviews.

Don't forget one thing ALL REVIEWS ARE OPINION BASED! If they were not then every reviewer would give the same exact score.

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Ben D.

Do me a favor and try not to tell me how I review games. I have no "preconceived notions." I've played GoW three times, and the third time likely won't be the last (odd how you say it's all "bullshit" and opinion, and then you turn around and pass off your OPINION on GoW's replay as FACT). And if everything I do is "bullshit" to you, than don't read it and don't bitch about it.

If you think reviewers are all useless and biased fanboys, you're an idiot. I'm sure every critic is very happy to learn that all their hard work is downgraded to fanboy bullshit because you say so. I'll just leave it at that.

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"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools talk because they have to say something."
-- Plato

"Small minds are interested in the extraordinary, great minds in the commonplace."
-- Elbert Hubbard

Dmitry M. (Lazer)

Yes i actually do think reviews are bullshit to tell you the truth. Only when everyone agrees to something Because all reviews are based on opinion. You are going to tell me if a movie recieves 50% rating on Rotten Tomatoes it means it's bad? Doesn't that mean the other 50% of reviewers liked it. And yes i am finally grown up to say i'm a fanboyist in my own way. Yes i prefer Halo over Half-Life and i like my XBox more then my PS2, and yes i like or liked NFL 2K series better then Madden.

I'm not bashing your reviewing tactics directly, and if it felt like that i'd like to apologize. I've never personally read anything you wrote but i am not a reviewer and i do not feel like argueing about this. I will just say GoW was not that special. It was another DMC to me. Yes, i know gameplay completely different, i have both games. But i didn't feel like i was playing something new.

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Ben D.

First of all, saying you like Halo over Half-Life, your Xbox over your PS2, or the 2K series over Madden doesn't make you a fanboy, in my eyes. We all have gaming preferences, just because you have yours doesn't make you an ignorant, biased, so-called gamer who refuses to play certain games just because they're not on your console of choice. I think you're being too hard on yourself if you call yourself a "fanboy" for the reasons you listed.

The thing is, there is indeed a lot of opinion in game reviews. It's an art form, and because of that, there's going to be a ton of subjectivity. However, there ARE several mostly objective aspects. For example, reviewers may differ on how they view the AI in a game, but even that has some objectivity to it- if the enemy is repeatedly running into a wall trying to get at you, the AI ain't that great, regardless of personal opinion. And look at graphics. Someone can adore Pulse Racer over Gran Turismo 4 (I'm sure it's possible), but no reviewer will ever say GT's graphics are inferior to that of PR's. That would make no sense, and there's really not much subjectivity there.

It is a sliding scale, though. When games get closer in terms of technicals, like when we compare very close visual titles like GoW and NG, there's going to be some argument. And both sides, provided they know what they're talking about, will make legitimate points. But at the same time, other things like Control aren't entirely subjective...I think avid gamers can tell when we can control the character on screen well or not.

If you read a lot of reviews, a lot of the subjectivity is mostly centered on the numerical scores. You have to understand that no two publications are the same when it comes to how they assign their scores. For some mags, the overall score must be an average of the previous category scores; others go out of their way to tell you the final score ISN'T an average. There's not even a set category listing to score on- we use aspects like Control and Replayability, while other sites use things like Tilt, Presentation, Depth, Fun Factor, etc.

But if you READ those reviews, you'll see just how similar so many of them are in the text. The vast majority of critics (the GOOD ones) will write very similar reviews for most games, and the only real difference comes out in the scoring because of how vastly different each publication is. But in looking at the text, while everyone will differ on a few small points, I think you'd be surprised at just how similar many of them read. I may have responded too harshly in the first place, but I do take my work seriously and I do my best to produce reviews that readers will actually find useful. I'm certainly not the be-all and end-all "final word," but I do expect my contributions to be taken seriously. I'm sure you can understand that.

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"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools talk because they have to say something."
-- Plato

"Small minds are interested in the extraordinary, great minds in the commonplace."
-- Elbert Hubbard

Mr. SunburnMan

First, I didn't bring up review scores, you did. Secundo, I did replied to your post, a post that didn't imply review scores at all. You were saying it tongue in cheek (''tis the truth' anyone?), and so was I. You've made a huge deal out of nothing.

Bravo. You win at the internets.

*claps his hand and bows down*

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Ziggman2g

O-----K??????

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Gabriel013

I guess what most of you meant (except Ben) was " My Favourite games for the PS2 are.." rather than Best Game's on PS2.

I do read reviews and am inclined to see BD's perspective. I can really like a game which everyone else rates as crap but if I try to say it's one of the best then I have a problem.

The problem with rotten tomatoes is that almost all the postings are baised. I'm sure there are people who give movies full mark ratings because it features an actor they like even though the script/settings/sfx/picture quality is crap.

I avoid reviews which include lots of I think this and I like that and focus on the objective comments.

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Ziggman2g

'Rotten Tomatos'...WTF!!???

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